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Post by Caylus Ark on May 16, 2018 14:49:18 GMT
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Post by Caylus Ark on May 16, 2018 15:02:19 GMT
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Post by Caylus Ark on May 16, 2018 15:26:53 GMT
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Post by Caylus Ark on May 25, 2018 4:46:35 GMT
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CM
Metapod
Posts: 64
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Post by CM on May 25, 2018 4:53:26 GMT
Oh hell yes, HEXEN 2.0 Tarot right again!!!
RE: DARWARS / TEN OF SWORDS
Read the text near the bottom.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 1:19:23 GMT
can we just spend a minute discussing the prisoner's dilemma?
Obviously, all they have to do is both stay silent. It's completely reasonable. So why doesn't it work?
Interestingly, it's only the sociopaths that get fucked over in the prisoner's dilemma.
Well...and also somebody that trusts the sociopath, if they are foolish enough to do so...
For if they were wise, they would suspect the sociopath would act in his nature and cheat, and then he himself would cheat, and at least the outcome would equally punish them both - except then, perhaps someone that thinks like that is vaguely sociopathic.
The irony is that this stuff is only a dilemma when you don't trust anyone.
Do you think that guilty people are prompted to confess because they want somebody to offload the guilt of their behavior onto?
Do you think that even if they are not guilty of a crime, either of them are innocent?
Do you think that because they both in the same gang, they will protect each other?
Do you think, that they will mistrust the other person not because they truly think that person is untrustworthy, but because they know if it were them in the other person's shoes, that's what they would do? In essence, fucking the other person over because you are yourself mistrustworthy and thusly project your mistrust onto others who in turn project it onto you or get fucked over by your tendency to autocannibalize?
There's something really interesting about this. It's not just a matter of optimizing the results. Some human beings, unlike economical computers, will shoot themselves in the foot if it means getting the chance to fuck over someone else. It is worth it to them to suffer the consequences of that just for the satisfaction of knowing at least they are not the sucker being fucked over.
And it ate itself again....
seriously..?
why?
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 1:57:20 GMT
I played a video game based on this concept. It was called Zero Escape: Virtue's Last RewardThe quotes are from the fan wiki.I had never heard of it and talked about it in length while I was playing it, as it was a metaphysical quantum prisoner's dilemma mixed with morphogenetic field theory and written on the wall of the warehouse in blood was the phrase:  it turns out to be written in the blood of the shroedinger's-cat-like old woman whom a certain player seeks but whom is only found murdered in some timelines. DARK. Yes. But very very interesting. And then there is the fact that Japan is not cynical in their take on what humanity can accomplish, so instead of annihilation we get humans pushed so far to the edge of survival that they unlock their hidden energetic powers and learn how to transport their consciousness between timelines somehow. Yeah... probably a niche title for some reason. But at the time I was around everyone posting about this and it just seemed so oddly...familiar...so even though it was a dark story, it was comforting to play because it felt like something my imagination would really get a lot of inspiration from. The story in a nutshell is this: So you have a nonary game which means it's based on the number 9. You have a virus that infects consciousness, called Radical-6, that makes people commit suicide. You have the prisoner's dilemma, in a rather complex iteration, and you have finally what appears to be - a zero sum gameDid I mention the AI Daemon programmed to introduce players to the nonary game and instruct them on how it is played is a white rabbit called zero iii?  then there's this cult called Free the Soul that we should probably talk about So...did japanese people steal the plot from a fringe forum on the internet? Who knows. In some timelines, Free the Soul ends the world. Do you understand the plot yet? No? That's fine. It would be weird to try and explain it when I just want you to see the point. There is a secret ending you get if you get a gold score on every puzzle in the game. I am probably better qualified to answer this, because I played the game: do you think the developer's mean to imply that virtue's last reward = death? I feel like given the tone and such the answer to that question would be yes, but having actually played it and the others in the series, I know it being a zero sum game is an illusion of the game master. So...maybe they meant there was a different reward in question... TLDR: just watch the trailer...
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 2:20:48 GMT
I'm not sure I myself buy the many-world interpretation (because occam's razor) however, I do like how this whole paradox is presented here and I think it's very suitable. I also think Phi's (game character's) presentation here kind of goes to show why I liked this game so much. I didn't always agree with the conclusions it came to, and actually I disagree with this particular video in many places. but I absolutely loved that it made me think about the questions and argued for its own sort of self-consistency within big concepts and also making the player sort of question the metaverse of the game and the player by asking how air could possibly be conscious. Sigma, are you so sure you're different from the air? I'm paraphrasing here. Zero Escape: The Nonary Games: Virtue's Last Reward - Schrodinger's CatI also thought it was appropriate to post this as a sort of strange educational video because this is a game theory thread and this is a video where a game is teaching quantum theory...  |
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 2:49:16 GMT
This one features an old guy teaching some game theory, specifically how one decides the difference between a program and a conscious being.
The game illustrates this by explaining a fascinating thought experiment known as the Chinese Room. You might like this one because it's 2 minutes rather than 15 minutes. But I think the 19 minutes the game spends teaching the concept makes it a lot easier to understand than this video. That's the cool thing about a game teaching theory, it happens to be a very effective way of teaching something because you are generally very engaged. Playing the game is easy, motivating an internet viewer to spend 19 minutes learning about the chinese room...well.
2 minutes it is!
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 2:54:47 GMT
This one features an old guy teaching some game theory, specifically how You could just read the wiki and skip the game, but the game is really interesting. It has some remarks. If you watched the video...the robot with the cockney accent that explodes in the GAULM bay and then is never mentioned again claims that " there is no difference between a computer being programmed and a person being socialized"....  implying that Searle doesn't even consider this, but maybe Sigma will think about it. |
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 4:00:58 GMT
True story: three(two?) of the characters in Virtue's Last Reward are literally just different versions of one guy, Phi is that guy's daughter, and that one guy Sigma actually finishes out the timeline by choosing to remain imprisoned behind the number 9 door until he is old enough to create the nonary game that he forces them(hims?) all to play in the past... and in that period of time programs the white rabbit zero iii while he instructs the true Zero, who is the mysterious lady promised to old man TenmeYOUji, how she will pretend to be the mastermind of the game in order to prevent the apocalypse from happening. The idea is they create a super dangerous game so consciousness will accelerate fast enough to draw out Phi and Sigma's latent ability to hop between timelines, after which they can go back to the third game's time and save the world, which has already ended. You see the warehouse is on a base on the moon. The true zero is tenmeYOUji's old lady who is actually murdered before you guys even start playing and has her blood on the wall spelling the creepy phrase "remember death if the ninth lion ate the sun", but only in the wrong timeline.
That was me trying to explain the plot but I don't think it makes much sense. It really is the plot, though, as I recall. Well part of it. It's a very complex plot.
On an unrelated note, are you asking yourself what a GAULEM is yet?
The fan wiki has a link to mk ultra which I don't believe was mentioned in the game, but I don't remember. Anyway, a golem can be something you call somebody who has been programmed.
The third game is called Zero Time Dilemma, but really pretend it never happened. That's my advice. It was not good. At all. And I really loved the first two Zero Escape games, so, even with my bias....fuck the third game. The title was cool though.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 21:24:24 GMT
Look, the question is "what constitutes a move in the game"?
but the answer is , "idk, I know it when I see it though"
and so they were like,
"but what if you are trying to move mountains with a video you know nobody is going to watch when you post it?"
I told them, "post it, then click on it wherever its embedded it and watch it all the way through yourself. it seems strange, but it's actually not nothing."
they were like, "what?" and told me they hate this game.
so I was like, "sorry, I'll speak more plainly. go back to the , ask yourself if your an esper, and if you answered true, you may as well give it a try.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 7, 2018 21:52:42 GMT
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 15:51:48 GMT
Another game series I think is theory-related is called Shin Megami Tensei. This is a game where notions of the player are challenged as to whether it is better to be chaotic or lawful. Generally, the series implies that the true answer is that neither is implicitly ethical, and that human beings are themselves empowered to know right from wrong without the intervention of other deities, whatever those deities may call themselves.
The Persona games are "spinoffs" of SMT which actually ended up becoming a lot more mainstream than the SMT games themselves. In 42 seconds, philemon explains that what happens to the world is the players choice, and nobody else's.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 16:03:34 GMT
Here is a cutscene from SMT that is a result of the lawful route, which means that the player aligns himself with God. As the angel comments, if the player follows this path, God will forgive humanity and even save humanity from the destruction that it has wrought upon itself. However, this means that free will must be sacrificed, because people will no longer be able to disobey God. This is the exchange that the player makes in order to create eternal paradise.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 16:09:25 GMT
I saw there was a poster on glp recently on that thread "she never meant for it to get this dark". They were asking about "the wos is trapped in a tower by the illuminati" thread, which was a thread that I made which got deleted. The following video is proof that this is a timeless story, which nobody had to invent, because it is imprinted on the collective psyche of mankind. The tale of the princess in the tower is told in this cutscene by a SMT game, and I think their take on it is rather intriguing.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 16:19:50 GMT
Unlike any other games, SMT games and spinoffs are initiation games, the creators of which were well aware of the gnosis and secrets which simply do not occur in the consciousness of our times. That does not mean, however, that the player knows they are unwittingly being initiated. If you're in some way an initiate, the player experience of the game becomes somewhat different, and more significant.
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 16:35:35 GMT
So I have been using this phrase "Shin Megami Tensei" over and over again and you might be wondering what it actually translates out to. "Shin" = True "Megami" = Goddess "Tensei" = Ressurection "Shin Megami Tensei" = True Goddess Ressurection  So if you watched the video, do you think it's satanic? I don't really know what that word is supposed to mean. This game isn't about Satan any more than it's about God. But I guess it does seem a little "mindfucky", doesn't it? What do you think they were going for with this? I have to wonder if they were trying to "do" something by creating a game that was also a spell of some kind. |
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 16:58:32 GMT
So I was thinking about how Japan is making these "magic initiation games" and the West is not. But I just realized that's not true, because the West developed the MMORPG (Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game) known as " The Secret World". You make an avatar, name him or her, and then you choose whether you want to align with one of three secret societies: The Illuminati, The Dragon, or the Knight's Templar. In strict terms of how these societies are portrayed, it is not very accurate. It is self-consistent though, and you can see the characters and nationalities behind how these societies are interpreted. Either way, you are introduced to the game as a player waking up in his own apartment and the news is on and talking about some terrorist attack somewhere or another. Well, you wake up in a dream where a voice is saying, "You will see the end of days. You will see the dawning of a new day...to be a Monarch, or a Beggar. To lose everything, or to become a God..." So basically your character in this dream is alerted that it's waking up, and it's warned there are many voices and many choices to follow. This cutscene, "In Dreams", does a very good job of illustrating what happens when you open the doors to initiation, and things that you should be aware of before you get too far along down the road. this happens, you wake up "a shining one" with powers barely manifesting, and then either the dragon, the illuminati, or the knight's templar knock on the door of your apartment and offer you a job. This cutscene is called "the job offer", and I won't embed it but you can watch it here if you want by clicking. Of course it'll be a different pitch depending on which secret society you choose to align yourself with. But you can't really refuse in this game, although you can break away from the society later. They tell you you have the makings of a reality bender and they can help you out. Essentially. |
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Post by Caylus Ark on Jun 9, 2018 17:06:15 GMT
One of my favorite scenes from "The Secret World" which I consider an absolute must-watch for anyone interested in conspiracy theories, seeking answers, or going on sites like GLP, is about a paranoid man in a laundromat who starts talking about how the Illuminati watches everything he does. As the player, you have the unique amusement of both thinking to yourself "boy, he sure does sound insane" but also on the meta realizing, "my character in this game actually is an agent of the illuminati, so it's kind of funny that this man is talking to me about how he avoids them".
That's not the best part though. The man explains that he's been able to get along fine up until this point because he "plays smart, plays along", saying "it's all just a game to them". The man explains that since they've been conditioning everybody and nobody is resistant to their control, the only avenue for resistance is through "role playing". He says that you'll find the Illuminati "in the dark center" "in the ghost house" "in the labyrinth". and he says "follow the yellow dot road" instead of "follow the yellow brick road" because he'd just been explaining pacman. For just under two minutes, not a bad watch.
When I think about the developers who scripted and coded this scene, I am under the impression that they aren't really speaking to the player's character, but they are speaking to the player, because they have the privilege of being able to communicate this message without sounding like a lunatic by premising the whole conversation in the context of this game in which it's all true.
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